So many discussions on boards about which team is more dependent on their star! Watching both Barca and Real week after week, I'm convinced that Barcelona is much more dependent on Messi than Real is on CR7. Messi was a force last night, but from my perspective it seemed he was the only consistent Barcelona threat from both a scoring and playmaking perspective. The number of touches he made (69) was not so telling (about the same as Cesc) as it was the way he carried the ball and by doing so spread the defense out and/or made them lunge (late) into fouls. "# dribbles won" doesn't seem to recognize the number of players pulled out of position and/or chasing him. His teammates on attack were almost invisible save one opening to Fabregas. Xavi and Busquets had a ton of passes, but they were almost all backwards or lateral. Pedro was OK at getting open looks for a cross into the box, but his crosses wear poor. Stats on "territory gained" please!
It's not about the goals or the number of touches that count. In the second half, Messi was much more involved, created 5-6 chances, had some good run and caused havoc to RM defense. He was the heart of Barca's attack while Ronaldo was disappeared most of the time in the second half when RM failed on counter-attacking. Ronaldo relied on his team-mates to create chances for him and once they failed to do so, he disappeared. Messi, on the other hand, can involve and influence the game. In that regard, Messi was well-deserved MOTM
I strongly dislike all this Messi-Ronaldo reductivism. Those two don't exist in a vacuum. If anything, their teams are constructed to give them chances. This was particularly obvious with Ronaldo today, who finished (very well, mind you) moves built by teammates.
This match couldn't have come at a better time for Real; just when they started to find their footing. And even though Barça has won every single game they've played this season, they've struggled a lot and aren't as good as they can be.
people that are saying messi was better needs to understand that messi is playing for Barcelona and gets more touches than ronaldo, who only got 33 and made the best use of it. not taking anything away from messi, he was sublime today, but ronaldo was equally excellent
Really Messi relies as much on his teammates as Ronaldo does, depends from game to game for both. The amount of goals, as a matter of fact, do count(when you look past everything only goals matter). Barcelona had a lot of the ball in the second half and created some good chances, but don't forget the first half where only after Messi's goal Barcelona started playing proper. You're saying Messi can involve and influence the game but how is scoring two goals not unfluencing the game? I don't think many people could care less about the motm title, but both deserved it, just like both teams could've won.
I don't get why people are downvoting may7even. As is pointed out, messi got more touches, hence why he has a higher rating. They both got 2 goals and ultimately decided the outcome of the game. Yes, messi might have a higher rating but it's clear that stats don't say everything, especially when the score difference is 0.3. They're both great players, and they were great tonight. I wouldn't say one is better than the other. This has been discussed more than enough. They play in different roles for their team, and thus can not be compared(it's like comparing Dzeko to Nani). They've both been equally excellent, and so have the teams been, which says far more than the performance of two players. After all it's not Messi vs Ronaldo, it's Barcelona vs Real Madrid. That's what El Clasico is. Not a faceoff between two players.
@dSquib Great observation about the ratings
@LessBlues True but it's in our nature to compare, and choose one over the other. Media always feeds us with this, and we always eat it cuz it tastes good.
Messi v Ronaldo may be reductionist usually but this was a game in particular where a lot of the other players underperformed, as the ratings indicate only 4 players above 7.0.
but that match at the Sanchez Pizjuan also showed the incredible array of attacking talent that Barca can call on - even of the bench - to get goals WITH THE VERY KIND HELP OF THE REFEREE..PLEASE BE FAIR AND MENTION THIS!!! YOU ARE UNFAIR!!!
2-0 for Barca
@Elbeast: I am saying that apart from goals (which are both equal), Messi contributed more to the team. And that's why he deserved MOTM.
bar 3-1 real
ronaldo 2- messi 2. great game.
So many discussions on boards about which team is more dependent on their star! Watching both Barca and Real week after week, I'm convinced that Barcelona is much more dependent on Messi than Real is on CR7. Messi was a force last night, but from my perspective it seemed he was the only consistent Barcelona threat from both a scoring and playmaking perspective. The number of touches he made (69) was not so telling (about the same as Cesc) as it was the way he carried the ball and by doing so spread the defense out and/or made them lunge (late) into fouls. "# dribbles won" doesn't seem to recognize the number of players pulled out of position and/or chasing him. His teammates on attack were almost invisible save one opening to Fabregas. Xavi and Busquets had a ton of passes, but they were almost all backwards or lateral. Pedro was OK at getting open looks for a cross into the box, but his crosses wear poor. Stats on "territory gained" please!
It's not about the goals or the number of touches that count. In the second half, Messi was much more involved, created 5-6 chances, had some good run and caused havoc to RM defense. He was the heart of Barca's attack while Ronaldo was disappeared most of the time in the second half when RM failed on counter-attacking. Ronaldo relied on his team-mates to create chances for him and once they failed to do so, he disappeared. Messi, on the other hand, can involve and influence the game. In that regard, Messi was well-deserved MOTM
I strongly dislike all this Messi-Ronaldo reductivism. Those two don't exist in a vacuum. If anything, their teams are constructed to give them chances. This was particularly obvious with Ronaldo today, who finished (very well, mind you) moves built by teammates.
fantastic free kick ..
I'm not impressed. Both teams are playing poorly.
3-1 win for barça
This will be a great game as usual!!! People whatever you do, do not miss this game!!!
Damn another Messi vs Ronaldo! Messi was a bit better in my opinion. I mean Barca... ;)
it is based on fact that Tito likes to play two wide players on the flanks(Alexis, Villa, Pedro and Tello) unlike Pep.
This match couldn't have come at a better time for Real; just when they started to find their footing. And even though Barça has won every single game they've played this season, they've struggled a lot and aren't as good as they can be.
people that are saying messi was better needs to understand that messi is playing for Barcelona and gets more touches than ronaldo, who only got 33 and made the best use of it. not taking anything away from messi, he was sublime today, but ronaldo was equally excellent
I like 3-2 Real.
Really Messi relies as much on his teammates as Ronaldo does, depends from game to game for both. The amount of goals, as a matter of fact, do count(when you look past everything only goals matter). Barcelona had a lot of the ball in the second half and created some good chances, but don't forget the first half where only after Messi's goal Barcelona started playing proper. You're saying Messi can involve and influence the game but how is scoring two goals not unfluencing the game? I don't think many people could care less about the motm title, but both deserved it, just like both teams could've won.
I don't get why people are downvoting may7even. As is pointed out, messi got more touches, hence why he has a higher rating. They both got 2 goals and ultimately decided the outcome of the game. Yes, messi might have a higher rating but it's clear that stats don't say everything, especially when the score difference is 0.3. They're both great players, and they were great tonight. I wouldn't say one is better than the other. This has been discussed more than enough. They play in different roles for their team, and thus can not be compared(it's like comparing Dzeko to Nani). They've both been equally excellent, and so have the teams been, which says far more than the performance of two players. After all it's not Messi vs Ronaldo, it's Barcelona vs Real Madrid. That's what El Clasico is. Not a faceoff between two players.
@kokichi, I have to agree with you on that, as a Real fan trying to be objective I do however think they both would've deserved it.
@dSquib Great observation about the ratings @LessBlues True but it's in our nature to compare, and choose one over the other. Media always feeds us with this, and we always eat it cuz it tastes good.
Messi v Ronaldo may be reductionist usually but this was a game in particular where a lot of the other players underperformed, as the ratings indicate only 4 players above 7.0.
Far from the standard quality of the el clasico. Both playing poorly. Real have looked more dangerous on the counter.
I like how AbweManchesterUtd is subconsciously identifying with Iniesta. Me thinks one plays FIFA too much.
A great night for football. Some living legends play wonderful football. Thanks Messi, Ronaldo, Xavi, Ozil, Iniesta and Pedro.
Amazing game. Messi at full power. Shame Montoya didn't score.
dream - i.e. i was sleep last night and see the score !!!
Agree that both teams will score, just a case of how many. Draw for me
Good points Elbeast!
This will be an easy game for Barca, 3x0 at least.
Over 2.5 goals
he*
Iniesta will play in Centermid if i plays. Alexis on left flank.
xmkr: with that back line you believe RM wont score any goals? haha, forever the optimist. I applaud your child like dreams. But grow up.
Almost better than a World Cup Final.
but that match at the Sanchez Pizjuan also showed the incredible array of attacking talent that Barca can call on - even of the bench - to get goals WITH THE VERY KIND HELP OF THE REFEREE..PLEASE BE FAIR AND MENTION THIS!!! YOU ARE UNFAIR!!!
Messi vs Ronaldo, a real El Clasico
Messi 1 - Ronaldo 1 so far...
won't be 2-0, both teams will score, 3-2 either way
2-1 dream him sry for bad ensglish