When you are a team in transition and consist of young spine of players you always build things from the back because you know its difficult to outscore your opponent with young but inconsistent players. And with united it makes more sense because of solid and experienced players at the back. I'm disappointed to see united go out but far too many times managers are held accountable but players are never questioned for their performances and fans for unrealistic expectations. Only top top teams are capable of winning and can afford to play good attacking football at the same time. And united are not a top team and won't be for at least one or two years. United are a club under transition whichever way you want to put it.
Sorry to break to you "deluded" utd fans , but if you hadn't chanted "attack,attack" and put pressure on your manager this wouldn't have happened. A saw the lineup today and knew this would be a high scoring game. Keeping the ball and limiting giving possession to the opposition was working well for united so there was no need to change to more dynamic football but at expense of being open at the back. And in tough European away games you need to defend well. Bastian and Carrick in midfield would have probably won united the game.
@NotBiased- That doesn't excuse how Utd reacted after going ahead though. If Utd conceded first then sure all the fans shouting "attack!" could be seen as at fault- but they didn't. Wolfsburg's midfield are nowhere near good enough that if Utd kept the ball for a cooling-off period and stayed defensively compact after scoring, they could regain it and attack. It's ironic that the exact type of play needed after Martial scored was the one Van Gaal has played all season yet he didn't in this instant. Dynamic football resulting in a lead then rigid defence and keep-ball after it to win the game is the ideal plan. Utd would've won had they done that imo purely because they'd limit Wolfsburg to scraps.
@SteveHyland Even after the first goal went in , I knew this was going to be a long night for united. United were too open with the lineup they sent out and the moment where Schurrle was through on goal pretty much summed what sort of game it would be.
@Farzad. hahaha, yeah, he's coming right over, he got his coat and bought the first ticket to Manchester along with a United scarf as soon as you posted that comment.
@Farzad. Why would Guardiola go that deep down to a club like ManU ? You sound like as if they just have to make a phone call and Guardiola would come running ...
@Castle You get a poor defensive structure because Mata isn't capable of proper positioning nor is he willing to burn stamina by pressing properly. Rooney does the job better.
@Gundam101 Yes I guess second goal and Schurrle's early chance got started when Manu's pressing failed, but I didn't see any mistake from Mata. There were many players closing down anyway so I don't know how much poor defending is down to Mata. However, Blind has positioned himself badly couple of times but played crucial part in their goal.
@mbengue Ha ha could be true! But that's hardly Mata's fault, Manu need wingers who can challenge in one-on-one situations. But glad to see a fast goal from United, probably caused Van Gaal a heart attack!
Please God don't let Fellaini start, we know what follows, 90 mins of smashing longballs onto his considerable forehead. Rather start Depay and put Mata behind the striker, please please please please please...
This match very hard to predict, either MU or wolfsburg will go into 3rd place. For my opinion i think MU will find a way and win. My predict for MU i think is 2-1.
A potentially excellent team held back by the manager's ineptitude and stubbornness is the leitmotif of premier league football atm. I don't see how Utd can win here, having watched them all season, unless an individual comes up with some magic. Van Gaal is playing an outdated brand of football. The days of having a 75-80% chance of winning a game in which you have 60%+ of the ball in are long gone. I see more and more teams putting an emphasis on developing a potent counter-attacking style knowing, against the better teams, they will have 40% or less of the ball. Unless he can develop a style in which his team can retain the ball AND fashion genuine goal-scoring chances against decent opposition then it's just possession for possession sake and that is a worse brand of football than route 1 imo. Anyways, I hope I'm wrong and Utd win for the UEFA co-efficient points, but going with 0-0.
@SteveHyland I wish I weren't so lazy or else I would post the link to the statistics that show that goals conceded via counter attack have decreased over a ten year period (from 05/06) in either the EPL or Europe. Can't remember which but I think it was Europe. The problem isn't the possession based game, it's the lack of directness and width in Man Utd's system. They also don't have any runners with the energy capable of playing a high pressure game which is required when you want to play with a high defensive line and dominate the ball in the opponent's half. There is also only one true 9 at the club and he is forced out wide (causing a lack of width on that side which isn't helped by Shaw's absence) because Depay isn't good enough. In fact the only out and out winger at the club is played at full back if he even plays at all. The problems come from a lack of proper recruitment. The only players that are good enough for this system are De Gea and Martial.
@Gundam101- part 2. I don't disagree Utd are devoid of midfielders with 'legs' but they often DO dominate the ball in the opponent's half (probably about 58-60% of the play was in Wolfsburg's half, which is big away from home). Their problem isn't retaining or regaining the ball, it's the fact they don't create much when they actually have it. I'd also argue against width in itself being the problem when Arsenal create loads from having Alexis and Ramsey on the wings and both coming inside. Only van Gaal can tell us whether Utd are trying to play a high-pressing system. It looks half-arsed to me and given he brought many players in, I'd be shocked if he actually was trying to play a Spanish style. I think that's actually giving him too much credit, I think in fact he doesn't have a clue what he's doing regardless of how many notes he writes, and a more tactically aware manager would get this team going- even if it's at the expense of possession.
@Gundam101- Part 1. I don't think you can post URLs anyway but I'm sure you're right RE: European counter attacking goals. I'm not against a possession-based style (Arsenal fan) but I'm also not talking strictly about scoring from a counter. I'm talking about developing your team around the skills needed to counter possession-based teams. Not all of Leicester's goals have come direct from counter attacks but they are a 'counter-attacking' team. Ditto for West Ham. I didn't see many teams put this much effort into counters until 2008. In Europe, when you have teams from poor leagues involved, you wont have loads of counter attacking goals simply because they don't have the passing skill or pace in combination with end product needed to have a potent counter-attacking style but in the EPL the number of wins from having sub 50% of the ball is increasing, sky sports showed the stat the other day.
I might actually watch this match over the Real Madrid match...I want to enjoy seeing England's finest and richest club on the planet get knocked out by Bendtner.
@WazzaFC The only way I see United smashing Wolfsburg in Germany is if they call upon the services of Hulk... And I am not necessarily talking about the Zenit player!
@WazzaFC In England there are many good teams but none of the big sides look too good at the moment and busy December will hardly do them any favor. After seeing couple of United's games lately, it's hard to believe they will smash Wolfsburg. It's uncertain if they will make even last 16!
A draw would be a satisfying result for Wolfsburg, while United must keep on going for a win to secure their advance. I think Wolfsburg are in a better shape now, but Man Utd consist of better players if who will not be injured, United can bring this match. Anyway a draw is the most plausible for me.
fck united
WOLVES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Lolsburg vs Lmaochester Utd.
So exciting!
@hyperion For United, so exitting!
When you are a team in transition and consist of young spine of players you always build things from the back because you know its difficult to outscore your opponent with young but inconsistent players. And with united it makes more sense because of solid and experienced players at the back. I'm disappointed to see united go out but far too many times managers are held accountable but players are never questioned for their performances and fans for unrealistic expectations. Only top top teams are capable of winning and can afford to play good attacking football at the same time. And united are not a top team and won't be for at least one or two years. United are a club under transition whichever way you want to put it.
@NotBiased sell De Gea, get Hugo Lloris
@NotBiased Don't be too disappointed, you can still bore yourself on Thursday nights with the architect of the Long-Ball Techniques, Louisa van Hoof.
Sorry to break to you "deluded" utd fans , but if you hadn't chanted "attack,attack" and put pressure on your manager this wouldn't have happened. A saw the lineup today and knew this would be a high scoring game. Keeping the ball and limiting giving possession to the opposition was working well for united so there was no need to change to more dynamic football but at expense of being open at the back. And in tough European away games you need to defend well. Bastian and Carrick in midfield would have probably won united the game.
@NotBiased- That doesn't excuse how Utd reacted after going ahead though. If Utd conceded first then sure all the fans shouting "attack!" could be seen as at fault- but they didn't. Wolfsburg's midfield are nowhere near good enough that if Utd kept the ball for a cooling-off period and stayed defensively compact after scoring, they could regain it and attack. It's ironic that the exact type of play needed after Martial scored was the one Van Gaal has played all season yet he didn't in this instant. Dynamic football resulting in a lead then rigid defence and keep-ball after it to win the game is the ideal plan. Utd would've won had they done that imo purely because they'd limit Wolfsburg to scraps.
@SteveHyland Even after the first goal went in , I knew this was going to be a long night for united. United were too open with the lineup they sent out and the moment where Schurrle was through on goal pretty much summed what sort of game it would be.
Man Utd fans are sick & tired of Louis van Gaal. LvG out, Guardiola in ASAP.
@Farzad. That, my friend, is the depth of delusion
@Farzad. hahaha, yeah, he's coming right over, he got his coat and bought the first ticket to Manchester along with a United scarf as soon as you posted that comment.
@Farzad. Why would Guardiola go that deep down to a club like ManU ? You sound like as if they just have to make a phone call and Guardiola would come running ...
Cold Siberia on Thursday evenings awaits
Bye bye Man U, now you can be boring on Thursday night.
Dive from Martial just outside the box
Wtf is that substitution Van Gall?
This is what you get when you play Mata number 10!
@Castle You get a poor defensive structure because Mata isn't capable of proper positioning nor is he willing to burn stamina by pressing properly. Rooney does the job better.
@Gundam101 Yes I guess second goal and Schurrle's early chance got started when Manu's pressing failed, but I didn't see any mistake from Mata. There were many players closing down anyway so I don't know how much poor defending is down to Mata. However, Blind has positioned himself badly couple of times but played crucial part in their goal.
@Castle Europa League!
@mbengue Ha ha could be true! But that's hardly Mata's fault, Manu need wingers who can challenge in one-on-one situations. But glad to see a fast goal from United, probably caused Van Gaal a heart attack!
Boring Van Gaal...
Rip M.U
Just bomb it down to Fellaini, lads!!!
So if PSV wins today and Wolfsburg doesn't lose this, Man Utd gets out of Champions. Good, they deserve it.
draw 1-1 / under 2.5 goals
Please God don't let Fellaini start, we know what follows, 90 mins of smashing longballs onto his considerable forehead. Rather start Depay and put Mata behind the striker, please please please please please...
Hopefully Wolfsburg can resist the Forces of Boredom and endeavour to entertain us in this game, it all rests on them.
This match very hard to predict, either MU or wolfsburg will go into 3rd place. For my opinion i think MU will find a way and win. My predict for MU i think is 2-1.
Am an atheist but praying for a Lord Bendtner goal. \o/
Glory, Glory Long-Ball United
A potentially excellent team held back by the manager's ineptitude and stubbornness is the leitmotif of premier league football atm. I don't see how Utd can win here, having watched them all season, unless an individual comes up with some magic. Van Gaal is playing an outdated brand of football. The days of having a 75-80% chance of winning a game in which you have 60%+ of the ball in are long gone. I see more and more teams putting an emphasis on developing a potent counter-attacking style knowing, against the better teams, they will have 40% or less of the ball. Unless he can develop a style in which his team can retain the ball AND fashion genuine goal-scoring chances against decent opposition then it's just possession for possession sake and that is a worse brand of football than route 1 imo. Anyways, I hope I'm wrong and Utd win for the UEFA co-efficient points, but going with 0-0.
@SteveHyland I wish I weren't so lazy or else I would post the link to the statistics that show that goals conceded via counter attack have decreased over a ten year period (from 05/06) in either the EPL or Europe. Can't remember which but I think it was Europe. The problem isn't the possession based game, it's the lack of directness and width in Man Utd's system. They also don't have any runners with the energy capable of playing a high pressure game which is required when you want to play with a high defensive line and dominate the ball in the opponent's half. There is also only one true 9 at the club and he is forced out wide (causing a lack of width on that side which isn't helped by Shaw's absence) because Depay isn't good enough. In fact the only out and out winger at the club is played at full back if he even plays at all. The problems come from a lack of proper recruitment. The only players that are good enough for this system are De Gea and Martial.
@Gundam101- part 2. I don't disagree Utd are devoid of midfielders with 'legs' but they often DO dominate the ball in the opponent's half (probably about 58-60% of the play was in Wolfsburg's half, which is big away from home). Their problem isn't retaining or regaining the ball, it's the fact they don't create much when they actually have it. I'd also argue against width in itself being the problem when Arsenal create loads from having Alexis and Ramsey on the wings and both coming inside. Only van Gaal can tell us whether Utd are trying to play a high-pressing system. It looks half-arsed to me and given he brought many players in, I'd be shocked if he actually was trying to play a Spanish style. I think that's actually giving him too much credit, I think in fact he doesn't have a clue what he's doing regardless of how many notes he writes, and a more tactically aware manager would get this team going- even if it's at the expense of possession.
@Gundam101- Part 1. I don't think you can post URLs anyway but I'm sure you're right RE: European counter attacking goals. I'm not against a possession-based style (Arsenal fan) but I'm also not talking strictly about scoring from a counter. I'm talking about developing your team around the skills needed to counter possession-based teams. Not all of Leicester's goals have come direct from counter attacks but they are a 'counter-attacking' team. Ditto for West Ham. I didn't see many teams put this much effort into counters until 2008. In Europe, when you have teams from poor leagues involved, you wont have loads of counter attacking goals simply because they don't have the passing skill or pace in combination with end product needed to have a potent counter-attacking style but in the EPL the number of wins from having sub 50% of the ball is increasing, sky sports showed the stat the other day.
@SteveHyland Or he can just keep having them smash long balls to Fellaini all day long.
Under 2.5 goals
another 0-0. or maybe 1-0. Van Gaal's team will not score this match again.
@iva They may never score again!
0-0
another chance for van gaal to create draw or lose match for MU.
0-1 Martial will score. UNITED!!!
@RedBlackWhite Fool
I might actually watch this match over the Real Madrid match...I want to enjoy seeing England's finest and richest club on the planet get knocked out by Bendtner.
@Beastador Keep dreaming we will smash wolfsburg. Only good team in germany is bayern.
@WazzaFC Deluded
@WazzaFC The only way I see United smashing Wolfsburg in Germany is if they call upon the services of Hulk... And I am not necessarily talking about the Zenit player!
@WazzaFC In England there are many good teams but none of the big sides look too good at the moment and busy December will hardly do them any favor. After seeing couple of United's games lately, it's hard to believe they will smash Wolfsburg. It's uncertain if they will make even last 16!
A draw would be a satisfying result for Wolfsburg, while United must keep on going for a win to secure their advance. I think Wolfsburg are in a better shape now, but Man Utd consist of better players if who will not be injured, United can bring this match. Anyway a draw is the most plausible for me.
hope wolfsburg win this one,and psv beat cska.
@glenbayern Long live Long Ball Van Gaal
wolfsburg wins/draw this one, psv take over cska = no lc for mu = lvg's era is over
Germans!